. >> the three big beasts in the budget remain medicare/medicaid, social security and defense. you have to cut almost everything else to zero to get close to balance or to make a big difference. so i think in today's world, given that those entitlements, even if you reform them and cut back back will increase as people like us eventually retire. it seems to me that sizing the government for something around 22 or so is probably doable. but not easy to get to. because you still have to have major cuts and major long titlement reform to get there. >> you see one of the major ceo guys, and i'm not going to quote which one, said yesterday looking for premiums on insurance to double because of obama care. and he said -- he made it very clear. he said we're going to cover 30 million people that aren't covered right now and it has to be paid for. irchbls's premiums are going to double. that they didn't tell us. >> that the costs would be up slightly. >> also, that's 30 million, 10% of the population. >> and that he they gave numbers to the cbo that said we were going to cut the defici